Thank you Richard for all the information.Most of the Johns you mention are too old to be our John. He was born abt 1768. We know from the 1880 federal census that his son, "Old Jack" states that his father was born in Pa.Also on the death certificate of Mahala, Pa is also listed as the birthplace of John, so the Johns in Maryland are probably not correct also. A researcher in the 1950s saw that Conrad of Heidleberg Twp, Berks Co. had a son John, about the same age, so he assigned Conrad as our John's father with no further research.Many people only do research from the Ancestreal files and not original data, so this myth as been perpetuated for 50 years, with no other proof. The Conrad of Berks Co. also had a brother, Valentine, who I thought was a good candidate for John's father, as he died in Va. and the name Valentine is carried on many generations in our family.Also the name Valentine did not come from Rachel Combs side, so again we thought this looked good.However after additional research we found he did not have a son John, so we were back to square one. Thanks again for your input.I sometimes wonder if we will ever find John's father.I guess we have to eliminate every John Eckert/Eagart/Echardt/Acord/etc in Pa, one by one.