Dear Sue I have just spoken to my father george joseph harmer, he inturn has spoken to his sister sylvia (named after my grandfather 'Billy's sister)she remembers visiting Roy Cable with her parents when she was expecting her first child. There appears to have been some resiliance to my grandmother Alice elizabeth maude Grantham the feeling was that she was in some way anti the cable family! this appears unlikely as she accompanied 'billy' on his visits to norman. Do you think it was possible that 'billy' was born out of wedlock and therefore was brought up by another family who already had children? Another gossip to the skeleton theory is that george, sylvia, betty and william all children of 'billy thought that Norman was 'billy's father. I also have been told that Norman fancied my grandmother, (not suprising really as I remember him as being a bit of an old sea dog)!!! Unfortunatly although all 'billy's children are surviving not one of them has any knowledge of his life or family knowledge of the cables or harmers. There is also a distinct possibility that george my father was not the son of billy (the plot thickens!!!) Just thought I would tell you a little about myself, I have been married twice, I was a 'bush' and am now a thursby. I have three teenage boys, Jordan 17, Kyle 16, Shane 13. I am 43 years old and work full time as a manager of a childrens home for bedfordshire social services. I live in the market town of leighton buzzard in bedfordshire, and have done so for the last ten years. The harmer family is spread from bournemouth to london and aylesbury to leighton buzzard. The only contact within the family lies with the children of 'billy' . Thank you for the information you have sent, obviously you have researched some information, and it was kind of you to share your hard work with me. Thanks again Sharon.