Catherine was notorious for lying about her age. I have her birthdate as July 24, 1867. She gave her birthdate as the year she came over to America. She was actually born in either England or Ireland. she and her brother John came over and their father had remarried and had a whole new family of little ones. Let me know what you find out about Helen. I will try to find a way to put the pic of her on line so you can see it (Catherine, I mean) if you are interested.