I have the death certificates for Fred and Sophia stating that they were born in Bavaria.George Shoner's death certificate was mostly blank!!But in his bio and other sources he states he was born in Bavaria.In the census that you found it states Wuttumberg (sp), I don't think the two areas are even close, so no clue where he comes from other than Germany.The death certificates for Fred and Sophia state that their mother was Anna Katherine Spitzbach, father was Lawrence John Schoner.Also states their parents were born in France, must have been during a time of conflict when Germany's border changed!!I also have a picture of a sign in German with the name as Schoerner that was in George Shoner's family album.I found George and Fred in teh 1860 census in Defiance County, Ohio. I know George went back to Germany to visit, but the bio states there was no family left. George and I assume Fred came to this country around 1851 with a group of thirteen or so.The story goes that he and the group came to work on the Erie Canal, but were treated unfairly so they ran away.I have his bio if you would want to read it. Fred married Frances Weisenburger, they lived in Henry County, Ohio.